[TF2] 11th Edition: The hats will never stop

[godFish]

If anyone is still up for some mannvmachine we've got 3 people on sepulch trying to win and failing if you want to join.

[Arcanum]

gonna be a pain to sell all of these post humous kill counters. and im selling them for a lower price than the spreadsheet that so many people revere as fact.

Scout doesn't need health on kill because he already inherently has it via cash overheal. Damage resistances are a bonus on top of that.

even with the 100 health i get per kill and the cash overheal, i can always absorb some more damage while antagonizing basically everything. crit rockets normally do about 270 damage (based on normal conditions. do charged giants have the same damage as stock crits?), with a 75% resistance to both crits and explosions, suddenly its not 270, its only about 17 damage. and thats with rounding up. normal heavies sans crits at point blank range do about 12 damage per shot. 75% resistance to bullets? a nigh meaningless 3 damage per shot. as the collector scout, you get a ton of overheal on top of it.

you wouldn't expect scout to be the tank

but he is

and boy does he do it well.

people thought he was good on basically all other game modes for capping purposes? replace capping with cash collecting, and add 3x deadliness modifier to his already impressive meatshots, and then give him an average of 500 overheal and general damage resistance and hes the robob's worst enemy

max overheal heavy (900) with a fully upgraded kritz in his pocket and orbital strike aka upgraded loch demoman (kritz pocket optional, especially with the loch's crazy damage with normal radius and health per kill makes him unstoppable anyways) are right up there with damage soaking and general deadliness as a scout with resistances.

i think tomorrow im going to work on sets and stuff with full upgrades solo, see how well basically everything does, and to get my hands on some essentials that would boost my overall usefulness in mvm and in vanilla. im not seeing myself losing interest in this for a while, this is pretty dang fun.

[Wesley Foxx]

The best thing is starting a round with a tank and a fully charged buff banner. And then a criteen.

"UNLEASH HELL"

Edit: Played a bit on Sepulch on Advanced.
It was frustratingly difficult to the point where it quickly stopped being fun.

[Ablaze]

Hey out there.... can someone try out this potential SR demo exploit I just came up with:

between rounds:
1: have another player switch to krits medic
2: build charge (takes around 4 seconds to fill between rounds)
3: use it on the demo
4: demo plops out all 14 bombs
5: medic runs back to base and switches back to their original class.
6: profit!

You can do the same thing using a kritz canteen, but this saves you cash.
And remember, you can simply shoot out another bomb to only explode one bomb at a time, giving you 14 separate krit explosions at a chokepoint.

[Recyth]

It does work. At least with regular stickies. Mmmph! and Rage also carry over so long as you don't visit the upgrade station, in which case it will reset when you purchase any upgrade.

[Superfrequency]

Scout is pretty excellent in MvM. Valve balanced it quite ingeniously. Not only is there a class encouraged to pick up money for direct benefit that also benefits the entire team, they made it so more than one scout is exponentially less effective. The problem with resistances for me is even when my team does really well I just never seem to have enough money to buy them and upgrade my weapon. Maybe you get enough money to do so on the advanced difficulties, but I haven't beaten any of those yet.

I don't find advanced frustrating. I find it kind of disappointing that I can never really tell what we did or didn't do to win, but not frustrating. Bad team composition and performance frustrates me.

SR demo exploit

I wouldn't really call it an exploit. It is a fine idea, though.

I think most "serious" team compositions in this mode should have a Kritz Medic. With all of the healing bonuses that are available to every class in the mode, and especially to the Medic, it seems like a stronger investment to have something that can quickly end a confrontation as opposed to prolonging it.

[Recyth]

I would give consideration to Ubercharge when Giant Heavy waves are up though since they have perfect tracking and rip people apart.

[Superfrequency]

Crits have no fall-off, so you can still sort of engage them at a distance to reduce the damage you take. I like to combine the Kritz with a series of uber canteens (and body blocking) for tough giants. Since enemies where you absolutely need uber are not as common, I prefer a more rounded build.

Really don't get how people think there is no strategy in this game mode. You need solid team strategy in order to beat the higher difficulties.

[Ablaze]

BTW, both scoot and spy get really good benefit from maxing their speed boost. Scoots can cover large areas of the map collecting money and killing spies. Spies can backstab much easier. and you dodge shots aimed your way much easier.

and the fan of war is pretty useful here.

[Wesley Foxx]

I really wish the standard starting cash was closer to 600. Enough to take one expensive upgrade or two or three small ones. Or even just up it to 500 so you can grab a canteen too.
Its pretty much "Pick one, nothing too expensive. Enjoy trying to kill two hundred targets barely buffed because you sure as hell aren't going to have enough time to upgrade further mid-round."

What are some of your favorite class loadouts?
-Soldier: Black Box, Buff Banner, Escape Plan/Riding Crop, Crocket canteen
-Scout: Scattergun, Mad Milk, Fan o War, Ammo canteen
-Pyro: Backburner, Flare Gun, Homewrecker/Powerjack, Uber canteen
-Heavy: Brass Beast, Shotgun, KGB, Uber canteen
-Sniper: Machina, Jarate, Bushwhacka, Crit canteen
-Engineer: Frontier Justice, Short Circuit, Wrench, Building canteen

[Moronis]

Sniper with Jarate at all times, swap between regular rifle and piss rifle depending on what mission it is.

[Catbread]

I tried a lot of Sniper and a little bit of a few other classes. Sniper had potential, but nothing else could even come close to Loch n' Load Demoman.

A single non-upgraded shot was enough to obliterate whole crowds of robots, and that's in addition to stickytraps everywhere, courtesy of the Scottish Resistance.

Next time I play I'll try more Demoman, this time with better Loch. I anticipate great returns on this investment. I'll try different sticky launchers, too, and see which is more effective.

I'd also like to try tanky milk Scout and Piercing Widowmaker and the Thousand Minisentries. Those aren't as serious, though.

[Wesley Foxx]

I've tried demoman a couple times, both demoknight and loched. Haaaate.

[Superfrequency]

Pyro: Flamethrower, Flare Gun, Homewrecker.

Weapon switch speed doesn't matter too much for MvM since you're not going to be puff and stinging anybody, and the extra 10% damage doesn't hurt. I can't justify rolling Backburner due to the sheer amount of projectile spam (you can regularly get double and triple reflect kills with a modest effort). The Flare Gun can sometimes make some clutch shots to stop bomb carriers, and of course fully upgraded it is a beast. Homewrecker is nice to be a pybro to the Engie. Back Scratcher is viable if you have no Medic, or even if you do and want to help them build uber faster.

Medic: Syringe Gun, Kritzkrieg, Ubersaw.

I haven't really experimented as much with the Medic. I use the Syringe Gun a lot to take out lesser targets like Scouts and support bots, but the Overdose is probably good here. I never get a chance to safely use the Ubersaw except on taunting bomb carriers, but none of the other options provide anything terribly useful. I can't do myself the indignity of equipping the Vita-Saw.

Engineer: Widowmaker, Wrangler, Jag

Piercing Widowmaker is insanity. Wrangler is perfect for this mode, and saves you having to worry about upgrading the pistol since your buildings are so expensive. Jag is a no-brainer. I feel like combat Engineer is viable, but that you don't actually need the Gunslinger to do it. Because level 3 sentries deploy instantly, you can actually just constantly move it around the map with no worries while you plug your enemies with the Widowmaker or Frontier Justice. And if you really want a mini-sentry, you can just buy one.

[Arkei]

I've been messing around with the MVM server files, and I ran across this little gem:

		// No Anim - NO NOT USE
		// T_TFBot_Sniper_Jarate
		// {
			// Class Sniper
			// Name "Jarate Master"
			// Skill Easy
			// ClassIcon sniper_jarate
			// Item "Jarate"
			// //Item "Master's Yellow Belt" // doesn't appear on robot models
			// Item "Desert Marauder"
			// WeaponRestrictions SecondaryOnly
			// CharacterAttributes
			// {
				// "effect bar recharge rate increased" 0.1
			// }
		// }

A jarate master robot would have been really cool. There was also the Heavy Weapons Gnome, which was tiny, had a wizard hat and beard, and had always critting Holiday Punches.

EDIT: Found the code:

		T_TFBot_Heavyweapons_Gnome
		{
			Class Heavyweapons
			Name "Heavy Mittens"
			Skill Easy
			ClassIcon heavy_mittens
			//Scale 0.65
			WeaponRestrictions MeleeOnly
			Health 60
			Attributes AlwaysCrit
			
			//Item "The All-Father"
			//Item "Point and Shoot"
			Item "The Holiday Punch"
			
			CharacterAttributes 
			{
				"move speed bonus"	1.3
				"damage bonus" 0.2	
			}
		}

[Superfrequency]

Heavy Weapons Gnome

Haha, oh my god.

If I make a mission it will have a round with giant Phlog pyros with the Pyromancer. And a rapid fire Crusader's Crossbow Medic.

Also a Smissmas round with all festive weapons and Candy Cane scouts.

THE POSSIBILITIES ARE ENDLESS

[Wesley Foxx]

I wonder how long it will be until someone makes a complete Turret Defense game mode using this system.

[Arkei]

Well, you can make sentries spawn and edit their properties at will, so that is definitely an option. Plus, you can edit the upgrades so you can make infinite, customized sentries, and so on and so forth.

[Gilo000]

Laser. Sentries. And mortar sentries, too, I guess.

[forkinyoureye]

Which is, you know, a terrible idea. I'd think it was a bug if they didn't point out that your other class still had its upgrades with a little green indicator. Why the hell would you discourage players from changing classes?

This means that you can't switch to the best team configuration for each wave, so you actually have to think about how well your lineup will work throughout the whole game. It prevents such things as all Engies for the 150 Scout wave on Decoy (or whatever map that is), which would make the thing entirely too easy.

[godFish]

An mvm mode with one defender of each class and a lot more robots would be pretty fun. Though maybe not for the spy.

[_Quietus_]

My wish is for a new bow
With swifter arrows
And possibly a longer draw time/ regular hitboxes

[Arkei]

I have some very basic knowledge on mission editing at the moment. What better way to improve that knowledge than to make my own ambitious mission? Presenting: SNIPERTOPIA.

Every single enemy is a sniper. No exceptions. However, with the powerful text file editing we have, we can make them fulfill the role of almost any other class.

The mission has five waves total. At the beginning of the first four waves, you will be fending off a sniper invasion. The combatants are: lots of snipers, and more snipers. Not only do you have generic boring snipers, you get very gimmicky annoying snipers such as the ants: Tiny, fast snipers. While they may have very low health and attack power, there will be a lot of them. A lot. So far, I have fire ants (they light you on fire, duh), pan ants, generic kukri ants, and shiv ants.

At the end of each wave, you have the privilege of fighting two minibosses, who are being supported by weaker versions of themselves. In the fifth wave, you will fight upgraded, super high health versions of each miniboss all at once.

I already have ideas for two of the bosses:

The Kidney Pill Overdose: Instant charging Sydney Sleeper, super fire (maybe) jarate, and an extended range Bushwacka. Expert bot AI.
--Miniboss version: The Kidney Pill Addicts. Hard bot AI.
----Support version: The Kidney Pill Abusers. Easy bot AI.

The MiniGun Machina Omega: Fires Machina insanely fast, with no other weapons
--Miniboss version: The MachineGun Machina.
----Support version: The RapidFire Machina.

So, while this will probably take a week or more to (learn the) code, it'll be a fun ride. I'm looking for suggestions on both gameplay, the two other bosses, and anything else.

[Superfrequency]

Arkei.

Please make a guide for idiots/lazies.

I want to make a mission.

I will have two tanks and a cloud of rocket jumper Soldiers trying to slam dunk the bomb.

[Arkei]

I probably don't even know any more than you do. I'm just skimming through the example files that valve provides in the GCF. If you really want to know everything important, watch this video that I haven't taken the time to watch myself: