Insipisphere Quest [RAK's Secret Project](Editor release 1)<accepting icon>

[RAK]

EDITOR DOWNLOAD LINK
NOTES:

• this installer will only work on 64 bit windows systems (i need packagers for 32 bit win and others asap!)
• you may have to download the microsoft c++ runtime 2008 redistributable (NOT SP1!) x86(32 bit windows) x64(64 bit windows)
• recommended that you install to a directory you own or have permissions to (meaning: not program files. note that program files is the default install directory)
• the installer DOES NOT make shortcuts. you must manually navigate to the install directory and run iqe.exe. (this and the default install location will likely change as soon as i figure out how)

USAGE

1. from the first screen, "new" and "load" do the same thing right now, this will change.
2. the second screen is the meat of the editor, you have two lists, one for categories, and one that shows items within the selected category.
3. once you select a category, you can add new items to it with the "new" button, or delete items with the"delete" button
4. when you select an item within a category, you have a couple of options. you can modify the attributes of the item (elemental association numbers for most things, allowable sex for classes, nothing for celement or weapons)
5. you can also click the "descriptors" button to change to the descriptors layer. it functions the same way as the previous menu. select a category for the descriptors you want to edit, and the members of this category show in the other list. you can add or delete these. of note, the descriptors are for the item you had selected when you pressed the "descriptors" button.
6. you can click the categories button to return to the category menu.

hello all, i am working on a project that could use community input on several levels. though i have not yet reached "barebones" i have decided on disclosure, as from here on out, i will need input to at least design mock ups. this is a game written in python and making use of the pygame and pgu libraries. the game is menu driven. the title is a working title.

the goal of the game is to play a successful session of THE GAME. gameplay will consist of menu driven, turn based combat. the best way to visualize the game play is imagining a 2d RPG without the walking around.

you generate a party of four custom characters, then the game will generate your worlds. due to the limitations of my coding (and other, more general reasons), many things will be abstracted. for example, as echeladders seem personalized to the player, not just class, aspect, or combo thereof. thus echeladders are abstracted down to plain old levels. due to the myriad kinds of grist, and how many of those kinds are unnamed or unseen, grist will be abstracted down to a single denomination.

due to the wide-open nature of alchemy, alchemy will be restricted to weapons and armor. you will have two methods of alchemy available, generating a new item, or upgrading an existing one. items will be dynamically generated, using a keyword system similar to diablo and variables pertaining to the character who is making the equipment, and the world the equipment is made on. equipment will have 5 levels of power, with a "hidden" sixth level for starting gear.

sprites will be implemented. at the start of the game you will get to choose if your session is a 1x or 2x prototyping session. as each character is introduced they will choose with what to prototype their sprite with, based on data selected in character generation. in a 2x session, the second prototyping will take place at the end of that character's introduction. sprites will only be usable on the wold of their player untill you progress to the point of having the amulet.

the game will be scaled for 20 levels (with an additional 10 for god tier). your saved characters can be used to play custom and bonus campaigns.

each class will have a usable skill, as well as aspect powers (usually) kicking in at around level 10. in addition to that, you will be able to buy/find freymotifs. each class will have 5 active per game, 3 solo techniques, and a dualtech with each other party member. most freymotifs will be the same inside of each class, differing only by how the aspect affects it... changing a damage type, for example. there will be special freymotifs for certain class/aspect combinations.

worlds will be generated like items and sprite prototyping options, based on classical element and/or associated item selected for the character at generation.

the game is divided into stages. each stage is comprised of a number of encounters. encounters are usually fights with underlings, but can also be discovering treasure, or visiting a town. the end of a stage is usually signified by a boss fight, and entering the next gate (of the famed seven gates).

in towns, you can buy stuff, do alchemy, and go on pointless side quests. fights with underlings will be divided into five encounter levels. encounter levels list normal fights, midboss fights(if any) and boss fights (as not every boss is going to be an unique storyline boss... like, say, a denizen)

eventually i will need sprites, backgrounds, and music, but that is a ways off into the future, i need to get the meat and potatoes done first.

this is what i currently have for class selection.

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male

knight
prince
thief
heir
page
rogue
bard
mage
seer

female

witch
maid
thief
knight
seer
rogue
slyph

weapons

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• Hammerkind
• Spoon/Forkkind
• Lancekind
• Canekind
• Needlekind
• Fistkind
• Sicklekind
• Dicekind
• Wandkind
• Bladekind
• Clawkind
• Riflekind
• Pistolkind

Interests

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• Movies
• Esoterica
• Art
• Gardening
• Detectives
• Archaeology
• Science
• Robotics

here is a starter for the associated item list:
(this list will be gaining additions pretty soon)

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• oil
• chalk
• amber
• uranium

Mad props to shinyjiggly for the sigbanner!

CURRENT NEEDS FOR DISCUSSION:

i need world descriptors tied to aspects, associated items, and interests. you can use the editor to make the file, then give it to me.

i also need personal interests see page 3.

also, i need objects to prototype your sprite with, see page 5


ALL OF THESE THINGS CAN BE WORKED ON WITH THE EDITOR (see page 9, at this time the installer package only works on 64 bit windows. i need packagers for other operating systems, especially win32)

you can submit music in ogg or mod format. this music must be your original work, and you must agree to allow me to include it in the game, must likely under one of the creative commons licenses, to be determined later. it is not set in stone, and i am open to other licensing that allows free distribution in my software.

the kind of music needed includes themes for -

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intro stages
normal battle
midboss battle
boss battle
stage select
victory
level up
battlefield
denizen fight
BK fight
ingame menu
main menu
load menu
save menu

if we can get enough music, we might even be able to assign variations based on character and/or world generation

[Blastoking]

Well, despite little information being put in, it seems you are working hard on this "Sekret" project, so I will give you my full support in this. And ideas/creativity you need help with, let me know, I'm not exactly one of the 'techy' people around here ^^'

[ObeseCatLord]

Bard and Heir could be switched, Gamzee actually had his Berzerker rage while John had wind randomly protecting him and Equis had the same with Shadows.

My only guess is another attempt at an actual Sburb game, if so good luck. Even if not so, good luck.

[RAK]

Bard and Heir could be switched, Gamzee actually had his Berzerker rage while John had wind randomly protecting him and Equis had the same with Shadows.

My only guess is another attempt at an actual Sburb game, if so good luck. Even if not so, good luck.

hrm, good point and easy switch.

and the quicker i can get these menus puzzled out, the quicker i'll be able to divulge my information. i am getting closer. the guy who wrote the pgu library and its documentation kind of left out some things... so he does things in the examples that are documented nowhere. makes it very hard to figure out what is going on and how to do something similar.

if anyone cares to know what i am currently stuck on, it is this: connecting PGU widgets together. specifically, i wish to have the active selection of a radio button influence what choices are available from a drop down menubox.

[Troublethecat]

Bard and Heir could be switched, Gamzee actually had his Berzerker rage while John had wind randomly protecting him and Equis had the same with Shadows.

My only guess is another attempt at an actual Sburb game, if so good luck. Even if not so, good luck.

Not really. John did do The Windy Thing consciously shortly before his ascension, though with much prompting from WV. It seemed less like the wind was randomly protecting him and more like he was using his powers instinctively and only thought to start exercising it more actively after he Ascended.

[Frost]

if anyone cares to know what i am currently stuck on, it is this: connecting PGU widgets together. specifically, i wish to have the active selection of a radio button influence what choices are available from a drop down menubox.

I know nothing about PGU specifically, but in all typical GUI libraries, you'd achieve this by doing the following:

- Register a callback function, or Listener class, which is invoked when the selected radio button changes.
- Within that callback, explicitly set the content of your dropdown box, based on the radio button which was selected.

It's possible that PGU allows you to explicitly connect one widget's output to another widget's state, but that's overwhelmingly the exception rather than the rule.

the quicker i can get these menus puzzled out, the quicker i'll be able to divulge my information

Why all the secrecy? Trust me, nobody's going to steal your idea.

[RAK]

I know nothing about PGU specifically, but in all typical GUI libraries, you'd achieve this by doing the following:

- Register a callback function, or Listener class, which is invoked when the selected radio button changes.
- Within that callback, explicitly set the content of your dropdown box, based on the radio button which was selected.

It's possible that PGU allows you to explicitly connect one widget's output to another widget's state, but that's overwhelmingly the exception rather than the rule.



Why all the secrecy? Trust me, nobody's going to steal your idea.

that was kind of the idea i had on getting it to work, just am unsure of the specifics. mainly i was going to go about it by making a function.

the radio button sends a state change thing automatically, i just cant figure out how to listen for it. as i said, the documentation is pretty bad. while i am proficient enough in python to get it to do what i want after some struggle, i am a bit rusy and of nowhere near the skill level to understand everything that's happening in PGU's source... especially with how poorly commented it is.

pgu has a widget.connect method. this (with pretty much the same formatting) is straight from the docs -

Widget.connect
Connect an event code to a callback function. Note that there may be multiple callbacks per event code. Arguments: code -- event type fnc -- callback function *values -- values to pass to callback. Please note that callbacks may also have "magicaly" parameters. Such as: _event -- receive the event _code -- receive the event code _widget -- receive the sending widget Example: def onclick(value): print 'click', value w = Button("PGU!") w.connect(gui.CLICK,onclick,'PGU Button Clicked')

it does not say much more than that anywhere, so i have to guess at the proper usage.

i think what i need to do is move my big if/elif block that populated the dropdown moved into a function. this function should be called in the connect method of the radio box group. that might work better than trying to call some widget.update method that is explained even less.

i also may need to alter the dropdown menu... it does not have scrollbars and one of mine runs out of the program window.

i could possibly use a PGU "list" widget, but it is not quite the same.

oh, as to my secrecy, it is less about idea thievery than it is about covering my own ass. if i happen to get bored or otherwise decide not to complete this before reaching a "barebones" state (highly unlikely, but i am not a risk taker) i do not want to let too many people down. i mean, it is hard to get hyped up about something you know no details about, right?

[aeonsleuth]

Guys it's gonna be another attempt to make Sburb.

[Blastoking]

Guys it's gonna be another attempt to make Sburb.

Well don't jump to conclusions, it's not like every single secret project on here is a Sburb attempt, which they aren't most of the time,

[RAK]

Guys it's gonna be another attempt to make Sburb.

perhaps i should elaborate a bit more.

when i say barebones, i mean "basically complete aside from art and music"

i do not think you can play sburb with no art.

my project, however, does function with no art.



so, any more discussion on classes? might as well kick that around for a bit, because i'm still stuck on that dynamically updating dropdown. i suspect i am doing something horribly wrong.

[Maxrim]

As far as classes go, I believe Rogue and Theif are pretty female exclusive, and Knight and Heir are both passive, while mage, bard, and seer aren't. Active classes tend to work as leaders or for themselves, while passive classes tend to take the background role. Dave only played at all because his friends wanted him too, while, though John was excited for it, he spent the duration of it focusing on helping his friends. Rose spent her time gaining cool new tricks for herself, and Sollux was a pretty introverted guy, impatient with others' inability. Gamzee never really helped the group much at all. He did his own thing, and when he didn't get his drugs, started flipping his shit. But anyway, that's just how I view it.

[FowlJ]

As far as classes go, I believe Rogue and Theif are pretty female exclusive, and Knight and Heir are both passive, while mage, bard, and seer aren't. Active classes tend to work as leaders or for themselves, while passive classes tend to take the background role. Dave only played at all because his friends wanted him too, while, though John was excited for it, he spent the duration of it focusing on helping his friends. Rose spent her time gaining cool new tricks for herself, and Sollux was a pretty introverted guy, impatient with others' inability. Gamzee never really helped the group much at all. He did his own thing, and when he didn't get his drugs, started flipping his shit. But anyway, that's just how I view it.

UU said that thief and rogue are usually female, but not exclusive.

[felicitousArtisan]

Bard is passive. It's already been said in the comic by UU. Bard is the passive equivalent of Prince.

Prince = active destroyer class = one who destroys x
Bard = passive destroyer class = one who invites destruction through x

In Gamzee's case, he brought destruction both to the King and to a bunch of his own party through his own violent rage. In Eridan's, he destroyed all Hope for his session by destroying the seed of their race's re population, two of the most stable helpful team members and also in doing so, killing the future benign empress of their race.
Active classes wield their element directly in a way determined by the specifics of their class, while passive more often act for an indirect conduit for their element and the class abilities work indirectly through them. In this case, I think Heir could be either. We've seen the wind working in his favour without him needing to actively wield it, suggesting passive, but we've also seen him directly summoning winds. I'd speculate Heir as passive, and as maybe the counterpart of Knight? Heir = passive protector = one who is protected by x / Knight = active protector = one who protects with x ? On the other hand, Page feels like a more obvious name for the counterpart to Knight.

[Frost]

so, any more discussion on classes?

I couldn't find this anywhere else on the internet, so here's everything about classes which has been explicitly stated by the comic. Can't promise I haven't forgotten something.

We haven't explicitly been told anything about Witches, Maids, Mages and Heirs.
Seers have comprehensive knowledge of their aspect.
Knights are "a warrior class".
Pages possess slow-burning potential.
Sylphs are healers.
Princes destroy things. They're active.
Bards invite destruction. They're passive.
Princes and Bards are both exclusively male, and the counterparts to one another.
Rogues steal for the benefit of others. They're passive.
Thieves steal for their own benefit. They're active.
Rogues and Thieves are both usually female, and the counterparts to one another.

In addition, we can make a few very strong inferences:

Maids seem to have defensive powers (Aradia timestopping Jack, Jane reviving herself). If so, they're probably passive.
Based on their descriptions above, Seers and Sylphs are probably passive, Knights are probably active.
Given their names, Maids and Witches are almost certainly exclusively female.
Both Pages we've seen are male; both Sylphs, female; both Seers, female; both Knights, male; both Heirs, male.

As for the rest, I don't think enough information exists for you to get the consensus you want. Way too many conflicting theories floating around. Just pick whatever feels right to you, then switch them out for the real deal later on. Or, if that's not practical for some reason, just delay your project (or the parts of it that pertain to the unknown classes) until Hussie drops more information on us.

[Nephirin]

Yeah, Bard is definitely Male exclusive, so you might want to switch that out with something else.

[RAK]

remember folks, active/passive does not equal attack/defense. it correlates to "benefit of others"/"benefit of self" and/or control of aspect/controlled by aspect.

despite the human love of symmetry, i doubt any of the classes are the same but for name and allowable gender (such as knight = male, maid = female but the bones of it are that they are identical... just as an example)

perfect consensus is not important. all that matter is that i can make some "informed" decisions on the matter, making my current divisions less arbitrary.

speaking of which, i'd like to thank everyone participating thus far. this has been helpful even at this early stage.

[Nephirin]

This'd be my guess as to how the classes work out. Though its not taking any particular note of the 'frequently one gender, but not always' classes. (If we did that, males would be down to two passive classes and females would be down to two active classes).

Male Active:
Prince
Knight
Heir
Mage
Thief

Male Passive:
Bard
Page
Seer
Rogue

Female Active:
Knight
Mage
Thief
Witch

Female Passive:
Page
Maid
Seer
Rogue
Sylph

[RAK]

Though its not taking any particular note of the 'frequently one gender, but not always' classes.
Male Active:
Prince
Knight
Heir
Mage
Thief

Male Passive:
Bard
Page
Seer
Rogue

Female Active:
Knight
Mage
Thief
Witch

Female Passive:
Page
Maid
Seer
Rogue
Sylph

of course, all i am concerned with is "always x gender" classes.

the only issue i have with your divisions is duplicating mage by gender. much as a slyph is kind of like a witch but "more magical", i see mage as something similar. possibly in relation with the seer. i think classes are made so much more difficult by the fact we've only ever seen a single troll as representing the class, and it is sometimes quite hard to see where class powers end, and troll powers begin.

[Nephirin]

Yeah, I kind of figured that Mage was paired with the Seer too. S'why I figured Seer would be 'female frequently, but necessarily' and same with mage. But really, its just a guess at that point.

[OrangeAipom]

Perhaps Maids are an active version of Witch? Jane revived herself from near-death, God Tier Feferi revived Wayward Vagabond from near-death.

Kanaya has said Sylphs are like Witches, except more magical. This suggests that Sylphs and Witches share their passivity.

[Nephirin]

Witch strikes me as a fairly active class, personally. It wouldn't really change much though, even if we did decide that Maid matched up with Witch. We'd still have roughly the same layout, just with Witch and Maid switched between the Active and Passive female sections.

[RAK]

Perhaps Maids are an active version of Witch? Jane revived herself from near-death, God Tier Feferi revived Wayward Vagabond from near-death.

Kanaya has said Sylphs are like Witches, except more magical. This suggests that Sylphs and Witches share their passivity.

it also could be that the life aspect represents itself in a very specific way, regardless of most class pairings, the exceptions being "inversion" classes like prince and bard that "destroy with/allow to destroy with"

also, kanaya's quote could be taken to mean slyphs are active, while witches are passive. or, neither... only that slyphs have more blatantly reality-warping powers, while the powers of a witch manifest themselves in a more subtle manner.

in your maid example, you are discounting aradia. aradia's use of time comes off as pretty passive, save timefreezing jack. all of those doomed aradia clones... instead of stable time loops like dave that preserved his own life, aradia had doomed timeline after doomed timeline, completely necessary to have enough doomed aradiabots present to suppress the black king's vast glub. of course, this could also be attributed to dave having an experienced player guide him, and aradia not.

this discussion has also made me realize that i only need a division of classes by allowable gender. the active/passive things can come later, so it is still good to discuss that, it only means that i can change the menu i've been working on, and perhaps do totally away with the dynamically updating dropdown that is still holding me up after days.

so yea, still divvy the classes by both gender and what i call "role" (defined as the attribute of a class that is either [ACTIVE] or [PASSIVE])

oh, and just wait till i get to the next big consensus section of development.

[OrangeAipom]

She timefroze Jack. That didn't benefit him, did it?

Then again I don't really care.

[Nephirin]

in your maid example, you are discounting aradia. aradia's use of time comes off as pretty passive, save timefreezing jack. all of those doomed aradia clones... instead of stable time loops like dave that preserved his own life, aradia had doomed timeline after doomed timeline, completely necessary to have enough doomed aradiabots present to suppress the black king's vast glub. of course, this could also be attributed to dave having an experienced player guide him, and aradia not.

The 'doomed' Dave that became Davesprite knew how to create stable timeloops too.

[RAK]

She timefroze Jack. That didn't benefit him, did it?

Then again I don't really care.

obviously, as i specifically excepted that instance. in the very first sentence where i postulate maid is passive.

in the same vein as "jack didnt benefit", feferi didnt exactly benefit from eridan's usage of his powers, either. i seriously doubt the black king benefited by way of gamzee exercising his power. the target of an attack power almost never benefits, regardless of if the user of the power is active or passive.

The 'doomed' Dave that became Davesprite knew how to create stable timeloops too.

touche. but in counter, davesprite might have averted his doom. davesprite also owes his existence to the troll who tutored him, for without her interference with john, dave would have never come back. so, you could argue that davesprite represents an active class, as he served himself many times over by way of his power (plus it allows him to do the knight-ey thing and save john's life)