IDE/Theory Thread 24: The Pink Moon's moon is Io

[Stormspirit]

Atomic: there is one ancestor per troll like there is one genetic parent per kid. The pairs correspond in sign, blood color, almost certainly aspect, and probably class. That said, Arenea literally just said that she is genetically Terezi's ancestor as well. You can see in the flash and in another page (can somebody drege up links?) that the tubes are in sets like the kids' tubes, but with three tubes per mixing trough instead of two.

She didn't say anything about being Terezi's genetic ancestor. All she mentioned was that she was, in a way, also her ancestor. This could mean two things: either part of her DNA was mixed to make Terezi, and that would still make her her ectobiological ancestor, or she was mentioning the fact she actually created her universe, in a way, thus making her the ancestor of every trolls, along with her fellow 12 players.

[techloveArtist]

while I did this everyone else enjoyed the update. huh. Meenah's got Vriska's bitchiness, Feferi's quirk, and Terezi's impulsiveness. not sure if want

(Quote from the complaints thread.)

Pffffft. you right an essay and as of now, I just pull this little tidbit.

Even though it maybe true, this got me thinking about how the trolls were arranged in ectobiology. We can kick out Vriska and Terezi though from part of Meenah mix (if the A1 group are indeed second gen) since our experience with the humans it was B1 kids (second gen) and B2 kids (first gen). Simply put, I'm thinking that a group do not cross dreamer lines. (There is a prospit group and there is a dreamer group for B but not both until we could find out about UU's and uu's situation.) Feferi, as sweet as she is, is a Derse Dreamer. It is possibly even that in that mix Meenah and Feferi are also with Eridan and then anyone that could be Aradia, Sollux, Nepeta and Equius.

However, we just simply do not know enough.

[Primal Zed]

(Quote from the complaints thread.)

Pffffft. you right an essay and as of now, I just pull this little tidbit.

Even though it maybe true, this got me thinking about how the trolls were arranged in ectobiology. We can kick out Vriska and Terezi though from part of Meenah mix (if the A1 group are indeed second gen) since our experience with the humans it was B1 kids (second gen) and B2 kids (first gen). Simply put, I'm thinking that a group do not cross dreamer lines. (There is a prospit group and there is a dreamer group for B but not both until we could find out about UU's and uu's situation.) Feferi, as sweet as she is, is a Derse Dreamer. It is possibly even that in that mix Meenah and Feferi are also with Eridan and then anyone that could be Aradia, Sollux, Nepeta and Equius.

However, we just simply do not know enough.

I don't think it matters so much which one was pre-scratch and which was post-scratch, but in which session the ectobiology happens. Karkat created himself and his friends from mixing the DNA of the trolls he regarded as their ancestors.

[cyberHeroine]

Karkat didn't regard any trolls as their ancestors, he thought that ancestors were for snooty blue-bloods. The evidence suggests that he created the trolls from his own group, because he apparently had no idea who the extra 12 wigglers were

[Legendary]

I don't think it matters so much which one was pre-scratch and which was post-scratch, but in which session the ectobiology happens. Karkat created himself and his friends from mixing the DNA of the trolls he regarded as their ancestors.

Except Karkat also seems to have understood he created himself, but not the twelve ancestors. He knows Vriska's claim, and if he did things the way John did, he would be able to say "Oh, your ancestor's a pirate? Well, the Scorpio troll I cloned was a pirate. So I guess that makes sense then." Instead he specifically doubts Vriska's claim.

[wrinklefudger]

I don't think it matters so much which one was pre-scratch and which was post-scratch, but in which session the ectobiology happens. Karkat created himself and his friends from mixing the DNA of the trolls he regarded as their ancestors.

But karkat didn't create the A2 trolls, he created the trolls from A1!

[Legendary]

He created both sets. That's what a Scratch means.

[wrinklefudger]

He created both sets. That's what a Scratch means.

he says multiple times he only created 12. meanwhile, there are 24 vials, yet only 12 ancestors. Conclusion? Karkat and A1's ectobiologist both used the same DNA sources to create different trolls

A1: {A1 ancestors}+{A2 ancestors}={A1 ancestors}/{A2 heroes}
A2: {A1 ancestors}+{A2 ancestors}={A2 ancestors}/{A1 heroes}

Through this paradox cloning, everyone is a recursive paradox clone of themselves and their ancestors, with DNA from 2 others and their ancestors. As a result, their genetic lines are less clear-cut than that of the humans, to the point of being a massive genetic clusterfuck

[Legendary]

...um...

And what about the OTHER twelve wigglers you spawned? Who were they? Probably further proof this was all meaningless and random. Could it be that they were the true heroes meant to be sent back to play this game, while your team was the superfluous crop? Could a mistake have been made during the reckoning?

So, yeah.

[unbeliever536]

There are twelve vials on the page Legendary cited, six for each trough. Presumably this means that ectobiology went down roughly like in the human session, with Prospitans in one machine and Dersites in the other.

[MegaRock35]

IDE/Theory: undyingUmbrage hates uranianUmbra because she always calls him by his real name, which he hates.

What is that name? Rocket Papaya.

[techloveArtist]

Well, it was four sets of six but I agree that 2 sets are prospit dreamers while the other 2 are derse dreamers.

WHAT'S WITH THE ROCKET PAPAYA JOKE???? It was already so common as a joke from the time of naming our original 12 trolls. Sound like something from Dr. Mc ninja or another comic.

[The Mather1]

Except you know Sollux breaks that pattern. It would make more sense if they were mixed according to blood color; Lowbloods, Greenbloods + Karkat, Bluebloods and Highbloods.

That most certainly would explain Meenah's violent tendencies and the Sufferer's peace and love message. It would also explain Nerdfang, Terezi's taste in fashion and Equius' disliking for the inappropriate could most certainly mix together to cause such a get up.

[cyberHeroine]

It makes more sense for Sollux to be on Prospit despite being genetically a Derse dreamer than it does for the clones to be arbitrarily based on blood colours. Not to mention that by all accounts, Dirk has more similarities to Equius than Aranea has.

[MegaRock35]

WHAT'S WITH THE ROCKET PAPAYA JOKE???? It was already so common as a joke from the time of naming our original 12 trolls. Sound like something from Dr. Mc ninja or another comic.

Someone just noticed that Rocket Papaya fit the 6 letters apiece naming scheme, and we all rolled with it. Likely because it is certifiably awesome.

[The Mather1]

It makes more sense for Sollux to be on Prospit despite being genetically a Derse dreamer than it does for the clones to be arbitrarily based on blood colours. Not to mention that by all accounts, Dirk has more similarities to Equius than Aranea has.

You want more evidence?
The Handmaid, the Summoner and the Psionic all fought and lost against Condesce.
The Sufferer, the Disciple and the Dolorosa were a family.
Redglare, Mindfang and Darkleer were wildcards.
The Highblood, Dualscar and Condesce were high-ranking government officials (Dualscar not as high as the others, but still fairly high).

They have more than just their classes in common.

[cyberHeroine]

The high ranking officials in question can only hold their position through their blood in any case. Dualscar in particular is only high-ranking because of his blood. The Psionic was also part of the Sufferer's family.

Not saying your theory's wrong, but your groupings are specifically tailored to it, and there are plenty other ways they could be arranged into groups.

[The Mather1]

Sure, he was a disciple of the Sufferer, but the Disciple and the Dolorosa were literally his family, the Disciple was his... girlfriend? ...and the Dolorosa was his mother.

[Vanymstorm]

Except you know Sollux breaks that pattern.

Yes, by having a second dreamself. No reason that should impact the creation process, though.

And if you're looking for a third influence to explain Aranea's fashion choices, you could do better. Where are you getting propriety as a motivation for that outfit anyway? I'm curious now, walk us through it.

[The Mather1]

Yes, by having a second dreamself. No reason that should impact the creation process, though.

And if you're looking for a third influence to explain Aranea's fashion choices, you could do better. Where are you getting propriety as a motivation for that outfit anyway? I'm curious now, walk us through it.

Can you think of any stereotypical set of clothes that is less daring than a librarian's?
Now what does Aranea look like again?

[techloveArtist]

Except you know Sollux breaks that pattern.

Yeah but that is only because of his duality. If he wasn't themed that way, he would have only been a Derse dreamer.

...and cH, Dirk isn't even a troll so I don't know where you're going with that....

And even though Gamzee is a high blooded troll, he is still a prospit dreamer so already that is the first case of splitting the high bloods.

And sure, Dolorosa and Disciple were the Sufferer's family but that was due to circumstances of A2...not what Sburb decided upon to make them.

I'm guessing the following...

Gamzee, Terezi, Vriska
Feferi, Eridan, Aradia
Equius, Nepeta, Sollux
Karkat, Tavros, Kanaya

And honestly, the clothing bit is kinda stereotypical. At least with the Scorpio and Pieces group, we have three uniforms.

[cyberHeroine]

My point was that Aranea is nothing like Equius. And the Disciple seems more like a librarian than Darkleer, in any case.

It makes far more sense, considering what we know, to assume that ectobiological siblings tend to dream on the same planet, regardless of the caste that their society places them in.

[d2r123]

Has everyone forgotten? Bavk i Alterniabound, when Karkt was at the ectobiology station, and created the trolls and their ancestors, he remarked that he ade two grubs for every combination. In other words, that each troll and their ancestors were genetic duplictes. Plus, we've seen evedence that the ancestor's have the same powers as their decendants. For instance, the Condense and Feferi are both capble of healing, and how Equius and his ancestor both have voids. So Meenah is also a witch of life, and Aranea is a thief of light. Any yet-to-be seen anceators willalso share their troll's powers, so we should be ready for them as they appear.

Uh, we don't have evedence that meena is a witch of life or that aeanea is a theif of light. We don't know that, for instance, a1 karkat has the same power as a2 karkat. In the human sessions, b1 rose was the same as b2 rose but their session has been proven to be a bit different from others.

[cinereousSynesthete]

/snip/
Atomic: there is one ancestor per troll like there is one genetic parent per kid. The pairs correspond in sign, blood color, almost certainly aspect, and probably class. That said, Arenea literally just said that she is genetically Terezi's ancestor as well. You can see in the flash and in another page (can somebody drege up links?) that the tubes are in sets like the kids' tubes, but with three tubes per mixing trough instead of two.

I am probably misinterpreting this and / or this was already pointed out but I didn't notice, but the human kids have two genetic parents each, just like regular human children.

[techloveArtist]

My point was that Aranea is nothing like Equius. And the Disciple seems more like a librarian than Darkleer, in any case.

It makes far more sense, considering what we know, to assume that ectobiological siblings tend to dream on the same planet, regardless of the caste that their society places them in.

That I'm in agreement. I myself used that to model an IDE as you can see above.

I am probably misinterpreting this and / or this was already pointed out but I didn't notice, but the human kids have two genetic parents each, just like regular human children.

Yes because Sburb is modeling off of Earth's foundation to reproduce. As regular human children though, no. First Gen are produced paradoxically. Second gen is mixing the ecto slime from the first.