IDE/Theory Thread 24: The Pink Moon's moon is Io

[Scarlet Smiles]

Neither Heart nor the Rogue quite jibe with your take on Nepeta's situation. Also, Bards are male-only. And it's "Psi".


..... Oh. Actually it's not even a "formula" anyway. You're just doing whatever you think fits, same as the rest of us.

Mind you, I'm totally behind you with the Dolorosa, it does kinda work. Though admittedly the main reason I want her to be the Maid is for the same reason I want her to be a pirate fangirl; I find it inappropriately amusing, and I secretly want to see how fast the internet can burn.

Your take on the Summoner would probably fit a Knight better, though. And that actually kind of explains the wings, too.

Yeah, I guess its not totally unique when you think about it. I just thought that the type of relationship I was focusing on was new. That statement was kind of stupid in retrospect.
I can see Knight to Page working for the Summoner, It just really fucked up the rest of my chart. Also, the Summoner was out to destroy the caste system, using his god tiered wings to rally support. Not that he was actually a god tier, but he was using something associated with his role and aspect to destroy something. I guess the main issue is how Breath ties into it. Maybe because the two Breath characters seen so far have either extremely high or low confidence levels? Destruction of pride, specifically the pride of the highbloods and seaswellers, could work. Plus, I like the idea of a typically weak class, Page, apprenticing under a traditionally powerful class, Prince.
To play the other side for a bit, the Summoners Knight could work well with Aranea's Sylph. I should rearrange the chart when I've got time.

[Scarlet Smiles]

Neither Heart nor the Rogue quite jibe with your take on Nepeta's situation. Also, Bards are male-only. And it's "Psi".


..... Oh. Actually it's not even a "formula" anyway. You're just doing whatever you think fits, same as the rest of us.

Mind you, I'm totally behind you with the Dolorosa, it does kinda work. Though admittedly the main reason I want her to be the Maid is for the same reason I want her to be a pirate fangirl; I find it inappropriately amusing, and I secretly want to see how fast the internet can burn.

Your take on the Summoner would probably fit a Knight better, though. And that actually kind of explains the wings, too.

Yeah, I guess its not totally unique when you think about it. I just thought that the type of relationship I was focusing on was new. That statement was kind of stupid in retrospect.
I can see Knight to Page working for the Summoner, it just really fucked up the rest of my chart. Also, the Summoner was out to destroy the caste system, using his god tiered wings to rally support. Not that he was actually a god tier, but he was using something associated with his role and aspect to destroy something. I guess the main issue is how Breath ties into it. Maybe because the two Breath characters seen so far have either extremely high or low confidence levels? Destruction of pride, specifically the pride of the highbloods and seaswellers, could work. Plus, I like the idea of a typically weak class, Page, apprenticing under a traditionally powerful class, Prince.
To play the other side for a bit, the Summoner's Knight could work well with Aranea's Sylph. I should rearrange the chart when I've got time.

[TribulatoryTerminator]

I see people are talking about ancestor classes...

Here's my take (in no particular order)

Dolorosa- Witch of Space
Condesce- Thief of Life
Disciple- Maid of Heart
Mindfang- Rogue of Light
Redglare- Sylph of Mind
Handmaid- Seer of Time
Sufferer- Bard of Blood
Summoner- Knight of Breath
Dualscar- Heir of Hope
Psiioniic- Page of Doom
Darkleer- Prince of Void
Highblood- Mage of Rage

[FFWF]

IDE/THEORY: Gamzee isn't god tier at all. He still has the (healed) wounds from his real self, which his god tier incarnation probably wouldn't have, and he also doesn't have any wings. He's just wearing the clothes.

[Limot]

IDE/THEORY: Gamzee isn't god tier at all. He still has the (healed) wounds from his real self, which his god tier incarnation probably wouldn't have, and he also doesn't have any wings. He's just wearing the clothes.

I would enjoy this theory a lot if he ganked the god-tier clothes off of a dommed dreambubble self.

[Sparrowsmith]

IDE/THEORY: Gamzee isn't god tier at all. He still has the (healed) wounds from his real self, which his god tier incarnation probably wouldn't have, and he also doesn't have any wings. He's just wearing the clothes.

Unless he god tiered before Nepeta attacked him and never told anyone.

[TBFProgrammer]

Again with the wounds? Gamzee could potentially have incorporated the wounds into his character, causing them to exist in his god tier form. This could happen regardless of whether he was or wasn't god tier upon receiving them.

The wounds do not provide evidence for or against Gamzee being god tier or, assuming he is, for or against having been god tier all along. They can be explained without any unreasonable stretching of the known mechanics under any of these conditions.

[Vanymstorm]

Disciple:Maid or Bard

both [the Prince and Bard] are exclUsively designated for male players.

So now that we've got that out of the way, hear me out. With the whole "love that transcended the quadrants" deal, we're banking on at least as much of a hopeless romantic as Nepeta was, right?

"But Vanym," you say, "Heart isn't actually about love." And that's true, it isn't... Not directly. But go dig up some piece of sappy drivel, (ideally the sickeningly fluffy kind, though the... other kind may serve well enough) and see how often the word "soul" comes up. My understanding is it averages somewhere in the neighborhood of all the damn time.

"But Vanym," you say, "we were already assuming she'd be a Hero of Heart, we're talking about her class." So am I. Refer back to your drivel sampler; the key word this time is "know". Shouldn't have to look far afield of the last examples. On and on these people go about "truly knowing the soul of another" and suchlike. Well not only is there an entire aspect dedicated to the soul, there's also an entire class dedicated to understanding things: the Seer.

Disclaimer: This interpretation is intended as a conceptual association, not a full storyline role. Vanym is not liable for aneurysms resulting from attempts to extrapolate viable quest or ability information from the above statements.

The wounds do not provide evidence for or against Gamzee being god tier or, assuming he is, for or against having been god tier all along. They can be explained without any unreasonable stretching of the known mechanics under any of these conditions.

The wings are better evidence. Andrew's prior (CANON) sketch showed wings, which Gamzee does not now have. Sure, we've got what looks like precedent, but the other exceptions have logical reasons behind them, and none of those reasons apply to Gamzee. a) Vriska always had the wings when we saw her in her actual god outfit, they were only missing when she wore clothes that weren't designed for them, and b) Karkat is a mutant, and we can't be sure the one in the dreambubbles had wings at all (or maybe they're just stunted, like his horns.)

[newbonomicon]

There has already been speculation that Gamzee had the tiger the whole time, well before now. Although, personally, I think taking it from a dead god tier self would be the best possible explanation, ever.

[The Mather1]

I'm going to guess:
Bard of Blood.
Witch of Time.
Knight of Breath.
Page of Doom.
Seer of Heart.
Maid of Space.
Rogue of Mind.
Prince of Void.
Heir of Rage.
Mage of Hope.

Just to fit in with the whole role suitability switch-around.

[Ace of Dark-Hearts]

Cross posting:

Anyway, this in particular stuck out to me:

While you get the ball rolling, I'll try to talk some sense into that mercurial boozehound.

Based on wild speculation, I'm going to say that Roxy enters last and gets The Land of Mercury and Xenon. Some Emperor of China was buried in a tomb chamber filled with Mercury, which would continue the deadness theme in the lands. (WOW, I can't believe I remember that. I'm impressed, self.)

[InnerRayg]

Man why do y'all assume god tiers can't scar? They're immortal, not invincible. I wouldn't be surprised if only lethal hits were reversed.

[FowlJ]

I'm just as curious why everyone is treating scarring like it's an injury. Scars mean the injury has healed already. Maybe God tier healing doesn't bother healing you twice?

[Branetheory]

Can someone prove to me that Gamzee is scarred? The places people claim are scars are the exact same colour as his normal skin. The only thing we know is that he doesn't have makeup where he was clawed. Lack of makeup =/= scarring.

[Pixie-elf]

I just realized...Does Terezi still have the ring from the black queen from their session?

If so, IDE: Terezi will find some way to give the ring to PM, and PM will turn grey and defeat the hell out of Bec Noir.

[Nokob]

Can someone prove to me that Gamzee is scarred? The places people claim are scars are the exact same colour as his normal skin. The only thing we know is that he doesn't have makeup where he was clawed. Lack of makeup =/= scarring.

On his sprite, they aren't the exact same color. From this page, his eyelids are #c4c4c4 while his scars are #c6c6c6. From this page, Karkat's skin is #c4c4c4, which seems to be the normal troll skin color.
For now, I'm guessing he has scars and they mess up his facepaint somehow, as well as possibly being a slightly different color than the rest of his skin. I don't know anything about how this would work irl, though.

Or maybe he uses a shade of facepaint that's practically the same color as his skin. Seems kinda pointless, but hey, he's a crazy clown.

I just realized...Does Terezi still have the ring from the black queen from their session?

If so, IDE: Terezi will find some way to give the ring to PM, and PM will turn grey and defeat the hell out of Bec Noir.

Nah, they destroyed it.

[Pixie-elf]

From what I've read, you have to work at actually covering scars with makeup. I'd test it out myself but I'm not about to coat my freshly scarred belly in makeup. :P So the makeup goes into the grooves, it might make it a lighter color but... you'd still see the indentions. Unless he's like coating it over and over. And I don't think Gamzee would do that.

On his sprite, they aren't the exact same color. From this page, his eyelids are #c4c4c4 while his scars are #c6c6c6. From this page, Karkat's skin is #c4c4c4, which seems to be the normal troll skin color.
For now, I'm guessing he has scars and they mess up his facepaint somehow, as well as possibly being a slightly different color than the rest of his skin. I don't know anything about how this would work irl, though.

Or maybe he uses a shade of facepaint that's practically the same color as his skin. Seems kinda pointless, but hey, he's a crazy clown.



Nah, they destroyed it.

Stupid brainpan. That begs the question how did they destroy the rings? Hmmm....

[Pixie-elf]

From what I've read, you have to work at actually covering scars with makeup. I'd test it out myself but I'm not about to coat my freshly scarred belly in makeup. :P So the makeup goes into the grooves, it might make it a lighter color but... you'd still see the indentions. Unless he's like coating it over and over. And I don't think Gamzee would do that.

On his sprite, they aren't the exact same color. From this page, his eyelids are #c4c4c4 while his scars are #c6c6c6. From this page, Karkat's skin is #c4c4c4, which seems to be the normal troll skin color.
For now, I'm guessing he has scars and they mess up his facepaint somehow, as well as possibly being a slightly different color than the rest of his skin. I don't know anything about how this would work irl, though.

Or maybe he uses a shade of facepaint that's practically the same color as his skin. Seems kinda pointless, but hey, he's a crazy clown.



Nah, they destroyed it.

Stupid brainpan. That begs the question how did they destroy the rings? Hmmm....

[Pixie-elf]

When you have deep scars, unless you're filling them up with makeup, it's not going to look or be even, or the same color. I doubt Gamzee really cared to spend his time filling in his scars with his facepaint.

On his sprite, they aren't the exact same color. From this page, his eyelids are #c4c4c4 while his scars are #c6c6c6. From this page, Karkat's skin is #c4c4c4, which seems to be the normal troll skin color.
For now, I'm guessing he has scars and they mess up his facepaint somehow, as well as possibly being a slightly different color than the rest of his skin. I don't know anything about how this would work irl, though.

Or maybe he uses a shade of facepaint that's practically the same color as his skin. Seems kinda pointless, but hey, he's a crazy clown.



Nah, they destroyed it.

Derp, my brainpan is not operating properly. Stupid cyborg parts. Now I wonder how they destroyed it?

[Blaperile]

IDE/Theory: Gamzee will appear with each Troll, delivering 2 bodies to be prototyped, and each results in exploding.

These will be the combinations of the Kids with their Sprites:

• Roxy with Nepequiusprite, which asplodes STRONGLY.
• Dirk with Feferidansprite.
• Jake with Solluxsprite, consisting of two different Sollux's, which gets annoyed with its own bifurcatedness and asplodes.

[Sparrowsmith]

The wings are better evidence. Andrew's prior (CANON) sketch showed wings, which Gamzee does not now have. Sure, we've got what looks like precedent, but the other exceptions have logical reasons behind them, and none of those reasons apply to Gamzee. a) Vriska always had the wings when we saw her in her actual god outfit, they were only missing when she wore clothes that weren't designed for them, and b) Karkat is a mutant, and we can't be sure the one in the dreambubbles had wings at all (or maybe they're just stunted, like his horns.)

Except the trolls can hide their wings?
Vriska did this, and UU said it's possible.

[semime]

Man why do y'all assume god tiers can't scar? They're immortal, not invincible. I wouldn't be surprised if only lethal hits were reversed.

Vriska healed her arm and eye upon gaining god tier, although you might be able to keep scars like i imagine if terezi was to God tier she
would keep her blindness.
unless you are assuming he attained God tier after his scuffle with nepeta : P

[The_Codfish]

Vriska healed her arm and eye upon gaining god tier, although you might be able to keep scars like i imagine if terezi was to God tier she
would keep her blindness.
unless you are assuming he attained God tier after his scuffle with nepeta : P

Vriska didn't heal her arm and eye when she gained god tier. Her dreamself was always like that. The dreamself reflects how the players see their selves. And in every instance of godtiering we saw, the player assumed the body of their dreamself (which is why Vriska became whole again and why Jade became a furry; that's how their dreamself bodies were at their time of ascension). Gamzee would be the only exception, considering his dreamself is already dead.

[mysteriousOutsider]

Vriska regained her arm and eye because her dreamself never lost them. Terezi's dreamself was blind so her god tier self would most likely also be blind.

If Gamzee's dreamself was scarred (because he wants to be scarred?) then his god tier self would also be scarred? Or if he didn't use a dreamself in the process, then it's because those injuries were part of his "ideal form" to him.

/IDE

edit: or maybe it's just that god tiering doesn't actually heal you at all, his living self became the god tier, and his living self was scarred. whatever.

[Sparrowsmith]

Vriska didn't heal her arm and eye when she gained god tier. Her dreamself was always like that. The dreamself reflects how the players see their selves. And in every instance of godtiering we saw, the player assumed the body of their dreamself (which is why Vriska became whole again and why Jade became a furry; that's how their dreamself bodies were at their time of ascension). Gamzee would be the only exception, considering his dreamself is already dead.

Prospit was destroyed by Jack, yes, but - unlike the derse trolls - we don't see a single one die except Karkat, and then later we see Tavros's body.
We don't however, see:
Terezi
Gamzee
Kanaya

Three trolls who are very much alive as well. In fact, allowing for shenanigans, all three of them could god tier post-prospit destruction.
Kanaya was seen in a dreambubble though, so probably not for her.
Gamzee and Terezi? The trolls with the most developed aspect/class? We haven't seen their dreamselves dead, and we haven't seen them dreaming in dreambubbles.
I'm not saying they are god tier, but it seems Gamzee found a way, and nothing is actively stopping Terezi from doing/having already done the same.