プロジェクト＝ホームスタック: Homestuck Japanese Translation

[bellipotentObjicient]

We now have an official dropbox containing all of these manipped images! If you would like access to this, please sign up for dropbox and pm me the email that you used for it! We also have an official group email: hsjapanesetranslation@gmail.com

We still need video editors, image manipulators, and translators!
The more we can get, the better.

HEY GUYS WE HAVE A WIKI NOW!

PLEASE CHECK THE WIKI! Just because it is on the wiki does not mean that it is set in stone. If you have any comments or concerns with what's up there please let us know, because it's entirely possible that we've made a mistake! However, unless something is completely blank, don't make any huge edits without at least leaving a comment explaining why you've done so.

Thus far, a number of MSPA comics have been translated into languages such as German, Polish, Dutch, even a Hebrew SBaHJ. So, why shouldn't we give Japanese a shot?

Well, the obvious answer to that is that Japanese is pretty hard. Given all the subtle nuances that don't translate well between English and Japanese, this would no doubt prove to be a daunting task.


That being said, it is not impossible. With the size and demographic breakdown of the MSPA fan base, there are surely plenty of Japanophiles/weeaboos/whatever-you-call-its available to help. Heck, maybe there are even a few native Japanese speakers. While I myself am not completely fluent in Japanese, I have a decent grasp of the language. Nevertheless, translating these massive web epics is a job far too vast for a single person. That's where you guys come in.

How this will go down

Once we've amassed a large enough team of individuals to work on this project, we can begin work.

Now, there are a number of considerations that come with translating into Japanese, especially for a comic like Homestuck.

-To keep it simple, all proper names of people and places shall be written in katakana
-Priority will be given to preserving meaning over preserving puns, idioms, etc.
-Given the nature of the Japanese language it is possible that something that is one sentence in English would be two sentences in Japanese, or vice-versa

Specifically in regards to pesterlogs:
-Typing quirks will be very difficult, if not impossible to preserve in Japanese, however, it is very possible to replace them with an appropriate Japanese quirk such as different pronouns, ending particles, or maybe kansai-ben

Possible examples, Nepeta might always refer to herself in the third person asネペタちゃんand end sentences with ニャウ, or Feferi could end hers with ギョ(fish)(actually, a friend of mine used to do this all the time, he was something of a gyotaku )
I've always imagined Doc Scratch speaking in very formal keigo

-Chumhandles and Trolltags can probably be kept in English for simplicity's sake, but if a reasonable means of translating them exists I may reconsider
-Pronoun use, level of formality (e.g. plain form,-desu /-masu form, keigo), ending particles, and complexity of vocabulary are all important and should be determined for each character

All of these considerations are of vital importance and should probably established beforehand. As such, any actual translation work will not begin until several things are established and standardized.
1)Character typing quirks/speech styles
2)Names of items
3)Terminology
4)Slang and recurring phrases
5)Other issues of interest e.g. use of giongo/gitaigo, etc

In addition to the numerous translation issues that exist, there are a great many technological concerns that we also face.

1) Image manipulations
There are a number of instances in which it will become necessary to replace existing English text in certain panels with Japanese equivalents. In addition, certain symbols and pictures that do not carry over well may have to be replaced. For example, the check-mark that appears in the English version has been herein replaced by the equivalent marking in Japanese

2) Video/flash editing
There is also a considerable amount of text in some of the flashes, especially the walk-arounds, and this will also require technological assistance.

We also need help producing videos and the like to use for advertising purposes to garner interest in the Japanese community.

3) Coding and stuff
As you can probably tell, I am not the most technologically gifted individual...
But yes, there's plenty of coding that will be necessary as well. Coding will be stuff like a site script that will allow for comics like this one, or perhaps something to help with typing quirks that would otherwise be unpracticable to do by hand, *cough* GaMzEe *cough*.

So yes, for a project of this size, a considerable amount of help is needed.

ALSO!!!
This is all stuff that's been edited and manipped thus far!

[Thedude3445]

Wait what? Translations of Homestuck already? Where?

But this is probably the best project for any sort of Homestuck publicity. Homestuck already has a huge fanbase, but if Japan got ahold of it... O_O lol

[Namboto]

willing to help with translating very simple words and phrases, although the puns are going to be deadly.

[Snoubouk]

Wait what? Translations of Homestuck already? Where?

But this is probably the best project for any sort of Homestuck publicity. Homestuck already has a huge fanbase, but if Japan got ahold of it... O_O lol

http://www.mspaforums.com/showthread...world-gone-mad.

Well, good luck then, and welcome aboard the translation train

[Anonymoose]

This would be interesting, as to help me with my japanese studies.

[BRPXQZME]

for your consideration

If you come away with nothing else from that post, please understand that the implementation of anti-wrap-breaking installed on this forum + Japanese is not Unicode-friendly and you may have to quote this post to read anything past this demonstration.

いろはにほへとちりぬるをわかよた

[felicitousArtisan]

I have a degree in Japanese. I may be a little rusty, but I could probably be of some use. Obviously I think we could do with a native speaker to go through and make this all sound more natural, sort out the slang etc.

I think the quirks, while we may not be able to keep them exactly as they are, we can probably keep in spirit. For example, if nepeta speaks all in hiragana (like Yotsuba from Youtsuba&!) and changes all her 'na' sounds to 'nya' sounds for a catlike feel "nyan darou?". 3s look like the 'ro' character in hiragana so...Nepeta talks like:
AC: にゃんだ３3う？ (OMHMYGOD SO CUTE, especially because I'm reading that as 'darorou?')

Kanaya could write in perfect standard Japanese, but put spaces between the words (because of course, Japanese doesn't do that) to give a sense of her very clear and careful enunciation.
GA: みんな　でも　大切な　仕事　を　

[bellipotentObjicient]

	

		

			

			
				
				
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I have a degree in Japanese. I may be a little rusty, but I could probably be of some use. Obviously I think we could do with a native speaker to go through and make this all sound more natural, sort out the slang etc.

I think the quirks, while we may not be able to keep them exactly as they are, we can probably keep in spirit. For example, if nepeta speaks all in hiragana (like Yotsuba from Youtsuba&!) and changes all her 'na' sounds to 'nya' sounds for a catlike feel "nyan darou?". 3s look like the 'ro' character in hiragana so...Nepeta talks like:
AC: にゃんだ３3う？ (OMHMYGOD SO CUTE, especially because I'm reading that as 'darorou?')

Kanaya could write in perfect standard Japanese, but put spaces between the words (because of course, Japanese doesn't do that) to give a sense of her very clear and careful enunciation.
GA: みんな　でも　大切な　仕事　を　しなくちゃ　いけません　よ。

Vriska....hmmm, what if all her 'ha' sounds, even when she's writing in hiragana, are written as the katakana 'ha' which looks like the kanji for 8? Also if she laughs, obviously make it eight 'ha's, and occasionally lengthen her vowels out to eight characters? Oh, and Vriska's speech forms could be like the sort an anime villain would use. She should totally call herself something like 'Vriska-sama' or something because that would be funny.

Speaking of 'ha' sounds, you could probably apply Feferi's ) ( H quirk to katakana ha's? Her tridents would, I guess, be written backwards with katakana yo's?
Sollux, you could make it so that all his long o sounds he writes he writes as 'oo' instead of 'ou'? So that he writes words like どうして as　どおして? Hmm, tricky one.
Gamzee...argh. Alternating between hiragana and katakana? Japanese and romaji? God, that sounds hard to read! I think we should look at how Kefka in Japanese FF6 speaks for this one. Maybe Gazee keeps flipping between politely form hiragana and casual form katakana... all my solutions for him are sounding difficult, agh!

Karkat could just speak in katakana all the time. He also needs to be RUDE. He should speak in informal Japanese to everybody and when he talks to people, he calls them all 'anata' or 'omae' or something. Basically he does that thing that English speakers accidentally do when we're first learning, where when addressing others, we say 'anata wa daijoubu?' instead of just 'daijoubu?' and come out sounding vaguely accusatory hahaha. In my head, Karkat does the same thing as Ichigo from bleach, and makes his 'nai' into 'nee'; (ie. sore wa shiranee). So Karkat we get:
KK: ナンダオマエカ？イイエナニモシラネーゾ

I think Equius should speak in keigo, maybe even Samurai dialect with all the 'de gozaru' endings? Basically he needs to sound kind of pompous and excessively polite.
Tavros perhaps speaks in polite form all the time? Or maybe he talks like a girl? He needs to sound kind of weak.
Eridan....I dunno. Man, these are hard to come up with, huh?

Oh, just checked the translation thread. Some good speech quirk ideas on there. I like Nepeta talking in 3rd person
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for your consideration

If you come away with nothing else from that post, please understand that the implementation of anti-wrap-breaking installed on this forum + Japanese is not Unicode-friendly and you may have to quote this post to read anything past this demonstration.

いろはにほへとちりぬるをわかよたれそつねならむうゐのおくやまけふこえてあさきゆめみしゑひもせす

vs


	
	
いろはにほへとちりぬるをわかよたれそつねならむうゐのおくやまけふこえてあさきゆめみしゑひもせす
Anyway, my take on your five things

1)Character typing quirks/speech styles

This can be done. You have to be very deliberate about it, though, and I am convinced that furigana is pretty much the best crutch ever. Particularly with number quirks there will be plenty of opportunities. For instance, Vriska can slip in plenty of ⑧ where a や, ゃ, or はっ pronunciation exists.

I do not think every quirk must be brutally enforced, since they are occasionally relaxed in the English as well. Nepeta would certainly have many catgirl mannerisms. That does not mean every sentence will end with some catgirl particle.

Of particularly annoyance to me is how to translate the smileys. A lot of Japanese readers see a sideways ASCII thing and go “whut” (YOU HAVE TO FLIP IT TURN-WAYS, GUYS). I think we might want to resort to graphics.

2)Names of items

I say use furigana + kanji like there’s no tomorrow (... and not necessarily always kana over kanji, mind you! I feel that just a little glossing here and there will make those things that just have to end up as kana names go down a little better). Japanese doesn’t generally have that problem where you use an obscure root and suddenly no-one knows what Pithecanthrope means. When you use both, you get the opportunity to preserve more wordplay, or at least convey that you aren’t really supposed to understand what the hell that word says but you read Japanese you lucky devil.

I think using a wiki to keep track of these dizzying terms would be the best way to collaborate.

3)Proper Katakana-ization of names

Okay, let’s get the easy ones out of the way first.

Earth kids (simple enough):
ジョン・エグバート
デ−ブ・ストライダー
ローズ・ラロンド
ジェイド・ハーレー (this is not how I pronounce Harley, but rather the more common way to put it in Japanese, and also closer to the name of the astronomer Halley, ハレー)

Guardians:
チチ (Dad)
ハハ (Mom)
アニキ (Bro)
ベクレル

And one troll:

カルカタ・ヴァンタス (taking a cue from the Sanskrit)

4)Names of lands
5)Names of titles and elements e.g. the knight of time could be 時の騎士 or knight of blood could be 血の騎士

I think XとYの国 would be the standard way to put Lands. Most of these will be pretty straightforward.

____

Barely scratching the surface, really, and haven’t said everything I have to say, but I hate to make a long post just to bore people
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Wow, these are all wonderful ideas! I'll probably update the main post in a bit to reflect these ideas.

@BRPXQZME: I see what you mean about the anti-wrap breaking. That might be somewhat problematic.

@fA: Given your degree in Japanese, you might know more than I do, especially in regards to something like samurai speech or older dialects of Japanese. I certainly have a few native speaking friends who, although they don't actually read homestuck, could still help with the editing to make sure it sounds natural.

[BRPXQZME]

*chuckle* you have passed my secret test of character! good job!

A word on fonts:

Anyway, a thing that slipped my mind was how KEY ITEM names and CONCEPTS that are capslocked for emphasis should probably be bold because the usual video-game go-to of color is not quite the best option. There is a teensy problem with this solution, and that is that I have a Mac, where text and fonts are 0kay with lots of things, even things you should never make it do.

That is to say, I know I can tell browsers to boldface the Hiragino and up goes the weight. I don’t think it works that way in versions of Windows that only have MS (P)Mincho/Gothic; can someone confirm? (And yes, it is reasonable to assume that many readers will only have the fonts that come with Windows).

I suppose if it comes down to it, we can just require a CSS3 browser for better fonts, but ensuring good compatibility is kind of a thing people should make a minimal effort to do when putting things on the Internet.

Technological aids:

Anyway, if we agree on using a wiki for some collaboration on terminology, I can set up Dokuwiki on my website pretty easily. Dokuwiki is my preferred wiki software because its ratio of lightweightness to similarity-to-MediaWiki is just about right.

I can also use technology wizardry to discover when sentences are very similar. Which for MSPA is kind of important and I would not recommend not doing it.

There are also plenty of other aids like Google Translator Toolkit that we might wish to consider using for collaboration. This is not an outright recommendation from me (I have not used it before), but I think we should discuss it.

___

So, uh, my Japanese sentence-forming skills aren’t that great, plus I’ve committed a significant portion of future time to some J->E projects already (), so while I am glad to help out in any way I can, I kind of feel like I would spend most of this project on the back bench watching other people do the fun stuff :|

[bellipotentObjicient]

Alright I've put up a very bare bones Wiki for all of us which I will link here.

I will also add it to the OP.

@BRPQZASDFABQERQEF, you know who you are
I've never used Google translator toolkit before but it actually looks reasonably useful. I will certainly look into it!

[BRPXQZME]

Sweet. I’ll be making edits here and there (already have, heh). If I’m not confident about how a translation should be, I’ll note it. I suggest others attempt to keep this protocol, so we don’t step on each others’ toes too badly.

[Geg]

Personally I've thought about what kind of first-person pronouns characters would use before. Here's my opinion on how that would work:

John: Boku
Rose: Watashi
Dave: Ore
Jade: Atashi

Karkat: Ore
Aradia: Watashi
Tavros: Boku (obviously)
Sollux: Ore
Nepeta: Nepeta (kids in Japan can refer to themselves by their names to sound cuter, so I figured that would fit Nepeta well. If not, the atashi is fine)
Kanaya: Watashi
Terezi: Watashi
Vriska: Uchi (feminine pronoun, but also rude/tomboyish, so I think it fits her)
Equius: Watashi (since he tries to act like a member of the upper class, he would probably have a more formal speech pattern)
Gamzee: Ore
Eridan: Oresama (fits him as the most arrogant troll. Maybe sober Gamzee uses it as well)
Feferi: Atashi (even though she's royalty she still has a kind of cute/immature personality. I dunno, I'm like 50/50 on her)

About the Gamzee/Kefka thing mentioned earlier, from what I remember Kefka's speech is generally extremely immature and child-like, and turns more into a generic villain style when he gets serious. I don't really think that fits with Gamzee's personality.

And certain things would probably need clarification from Andrew. Like does the Maid in Maid of Time mean like a housemaid or just maiden?

[Namboto]

I'd say equius would probably use Watakushi, just to amp up the formality.

Karkat'd probably refer to everyone as Konoyaro, a slang form of "you" that's really offensive.

[Kishmond]

I have lived there for 2 years. . .

Sorry if this is prying (and off topic), but may I ask why you lived in Japan for 2 years?

[bellipotentObjicient]

@BRP: I like the edits thus far. I'm especially fond of the translations for Echeladder and Alchemizer (I assume those were you).
@Geg: I like the pronouns, I think I'll update the character pages to show that. My guess would probably be that Maid of Time is probably Maiden of Time, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

Perhaps Tavros could speak with a kind of stutter on the first word of each sentence. e.g. ぼ−僕は。。。Just a thought.

EDIT: Maybe Equius could use wagahai（吾輩）

I also really want someone to use chin (朕) but I don't think it'll ever be appropriate. Maybe for sober gamzee? I'm looking into some more archaic pronouns which may or may not be appropriate.

[deldisco]

Here's a question that may or may not be relevant, but:
Is there a Japanese analog to American "Bro" culture?

[BRPXQZME]

Here's a question that may or may not be relevant, but:
Is there a Japanese analog to American "Bro" culture?

Not really, and that is the toughest translation puzzle presently on my mind. The only easy way to get away with it is to say everyone’s speaking English in-’verse. But at least you can talk like a bro in Japanese. You can be a moron in just about any real language.

For Equius, he strikes me as somewhere between wagahai and sessha. And for Vriska, uchi works but she might be ora for all we know (YAR HAR HARRRR because she’s a pir8 ). But really, a lot of characters I just don’t know how they would talk in Japanese. It’s kind of like those discussions where none of us can quite put our finger on what they really sound like *shrug*

And yes, that is me on the wiki, and yes, Wikia is being a dunkass and not changing my avatar so now my ugly mug graces my profile. For now.

[octocephalicDragon]

Interesting. Perhaps Terezi and Sollux make number puns to get their blind prophet quirk going? Like, Terezi will work 四 一 三 into the pronunciation her text even when it doesn't belong, or maybe those will be the only kanji she uses and the rest is kana? Gamzee alternating between hiragana and katakana? This opens up a lot of opportunity to work 2ch memes into the troll's dialogue.

To be honest the translation of Homestuck into any language just kind of sounds like a nightmarish task due to how much wordplay and puns goes into everything. And just how much fluency will be required to replicate Rose's journal? But I'll be watching with curiosity as to how this goes.

[misterTeatime]

I'm in, but we'll NEED native speakers to check the writing.

For troll quirks, I'd probably support Karkat speaking in katakana. Someone was doing that on the big translation thread and it seemed Karkat-y to me at least.
Sollux could work in the kanji 二 every time he says the syllable "ni."
Vriska could maybe write her は's with the kanji 八 since it looks like the katakana ha anyway.
You could make a trident for Feferi if she ended her sentences with "yo" but wrote it ヨー.
I like the spaces thing for Kanaya, but I think when you put spaces in Japanese, particles and です usually get bundled in with the word before them, like 私の　名前は　カナヤです。

SBaHJ could be based on typos + hilariously bad kanji conversions, so the SORD could be ”k棚”　(which is what happens when I skip the first "a" in "katana") or some such thing.

I'm not sure about how this would look to a native speaker, but it might work to format the names of Lands like planet names, with appropriate kanji + 星. Might be able to get the words yin and yang into John and Rose's planets, since they've also got meanings like "shade" and "sunlight":
LOWAS 風陰星　（Possible reading ふういんせい?）
LOLAR　陽雨星　（よううせい?）
LOHAC　熱鉄星　（ねってつせい? I think "Iron" works for "clockwork" here, it sounds cool at least.)
LOFAF 霜蛙星　（そうあせい? possibly weird because the on-reading for frog is so uncommon)
Whatever system we use, may God have mercy on us when we translate LOLCAT. Anyone know any cat-based Japanese memes?

We should also put someone in charge of callback management, so we can keep track of what slightly-different sentences our translation has to accommodate later on. Like the "I'm not made of time." "I am." joke between Dave and Aradia. Eek.

I'm all excited now. This task is gonna suck and rock at the same time. But mostly rock.

[BRPXQZME]

Whatever system we use, may God have mercy on us when we translate LOLCAT. Anyone know any cat-based Japanese memes?

Most Japanese memes are cat-based. Only slightly kidding.

[felicitousArtisan]

[QUOTE=BRPXQZME;5161980]

For Equius, he strikes me as somewhere between wagahai and sessha. And for Vriska, uchi works but she might be ora for all we know (YAR HAR HARRRR because she’s a pir8 ). But really, a lot of characters I just don’t know how they would talk in Japanese. It’s kind of like those discussions where none of us can quite put our finger on what they really sound like *shrug*

Vriska uses 'Ora' now. It's Canon. It has to be. It's too amazing to not be.

I'm kind of of the opinion that Kanaya should use 'watakushi' , because it's the proper, formal reading of the kanji. I rather like 'wagahai' for Equius. Oh, on a random equius note. I assume that for objects like the bathtub/ablution trap, we do it so that the other trolls use the old Japanese kanji-based words, and he insists on using the 'proper' name of modern English loanwords? So they're all calling it the 'ofurou' and he's wanting them to call it a 'basutabbu'?
For Fef, I think maybe 'Uchi' might work? It's kind of more formal, but also quite cute.

Karkat should refer to everybody as 'Omee' (repeating what I said earlier where he slurs his endings like Ichigo from Bleach, so that ae and ai sounds become ee). Refering to people with a pronoun is rude and accusatory sounding as it is; I don't think we need him calling everybody 'yarou' on top personally.

Thoughts on Terez's quirk: This one is going to be one of the hardest to implement in a way. Terezi speaks in all caps, so let's just assume katakana, here. That means that going on similarity... 3=YO, 1=NO, 4=CHI?
GC: ドウシタ１デーブコレ楽シクナイ？

[bellipotentObjicient]

@Mister Teatime: I would be more apt to go with your idea for naming the planets if they were actually called planets, but because they're called lands, I think 国 is more appropriate. The SBaHJ stuff is going to be a lot harder to do; it will certainly require a great deal of help from native speakers. As for callbacks, when we get to that point in the comic, we'll have this stuff set up on the wiki page to take care of it. As for certain puns, it may be necessary to scrap them altogether in some cases because trying to preserve them would be a nightmare.

@felicitous: I am in love with your ideas for Equius. I'm going to add that stuff to the wiki.

@EVERYONE: Please feel free to check the wiki! The link is in the OP and it'll allow you to see how everything is going so far.

EDIT: I actually just thought of something. What are we to do about movie quotes? Has anybody seen Con Air in Japanese? I know it exists, I've actually seen advertisements for it in Japan.

[BRPXQZME]

Haha whoops looks like I wiped out a couple edits with that bigass sorting sorry about that.

... I am not a fan of MediaWiki’s cavalier attitude towards merging :|

[nocturnalViolet]

Non-native Japanese speaker that would love to help out here
My Japanese is probably more than a bit rusty, since I barely have any opportunity to talk in Japanese in southern California, but I...guess it will be enough?
But then again I have finals next week, and I have to go back to China for more than a month after June 13th (where I would have limited network connections) so I would be missing out on a lot of things in the future...

But anyways, here's some opinions/suggestions:

On the land names: I like 国, but a more accurate translation of "land" would be 地。 I'm not really sure about this, however, since it can also mean "earth".

I was thinking that (pre-god tier) Aradia's quirk would be translated as writing おs and may be をs in katakana(=オ＆ヲ), but would that be obvious enough?
If not, the entire -o row could also be rendered in a similar manner, but that's probably going too far...

Also, I noticed on the wiki that the current translation of the harlequin doll is 「アルレッキーノの人形」, the first part of which I've never heard of before...
The literal translation to harlequin would be 道化 or just simply ハーレクイン.
On another wiki-related matter, Sollux's title works definitely works better with 破滅, since the actual definition for 運命 is "fate".

I guess I'll come back here to post if I get any other ideas

[Zizzo]

Could Terezi's H3H3H3H3 laugh work as シシシシシ? I was thinking it could be a kind of 四/死 play on her numerals of the Blind Prophets and general creep factor. Plus, it's a creepy-sounding laugh.

(My Japanese is pretty dang poor, but I am still ridiculously excited over this project! I hope you don't mind another lurker)