Art of Domination - Thread 02

[Mayu_Zane]

Unless they're also shipping to region 1, there we can try a counter-offer or reasoning.

That doesn't seem to be the case. All the food's just for Region 4.

[Dragoshi]

I'm thinking we make a counter-offer, using our Improved Generators as the bargaining chip. Maybe a little bribe if that isn't enough, but not too much. Don't wanna spread ourselves too thin '-'

Besides, weren't we planning on offering the use of our Generators ot Una-G anyways~?

So I can see this as a good way to some birds with a single stone

[Andorxor]

>Let them supply Smiths troop,but demand that they than pay for any test that must be done on the products you will buy to detect any region 1 nastiness in them.We have refugees to feed,we don't want t to anger the biggest food producer,on the other hand we don't want the refugees to turn into zombies because one of Smiths men slipped something in our food,while they got their food.

[RatherInconsiderateFellow]

I'd say start with reason and fall back onto counter offer if reasoning fails.

The main problem Una-G has is gangs stealing their shit, and one of our objectives happens to be getting rid of those gangs. We don't really have to commit resources specifically to defend them, as we'll be mopping the gangs out of the cities anyways.

If we can get them to stop feeding smith's troops without giving up anything, we're golden. If they don't see reason, I'm sure they'd like to use our generators, and we're still fine.

On the other hand, starving Smith's troops will probably make them desperate, and we know what kind of shit goes down when they get desperate.

But yeah, I say we go for reasoning, and counter offer if it doesn't work.

[gloomyMoron]

Eh? I just had a thought. We reason/counter-off with UNA-G, but not to stop them from selling food to Smith's troops but to start overcharging them. Reason will work best and we should be wary of anything getting into the food supply, but hmm. I kind of like that idea. >.> We can also help them transport food and protect them, since we're aiming to take out the gangs anyway.

[Koeqepp]

With current choices I say go with reasoning and if that fails go with the counter offers. However what if we ask them to stop shipping food to smiths troops but still allow them to pick it up in person? They still can get the food but only if they come and get it while we watch.

[Hype]

There's nothing to say we can't tail smiths' troops when they leave... meaning they'll either stop going on their own - attack it and we'll protect it - or they'll lead us to even more of them. Let una keep supplying them - only good things can come of it.

[The_Codfish]

Wait, Smith's forces are transporting food to other people? As in, the people who've been creating parasitic unholy abominations? Yeah. We really don't want that. We should reason with the branch executive and try to explain how dangerous it'd be to allow Smith's people to handle transporting their goods. Just because they HAVE to sell food to everybody doesn't mean they should let criminals like Smith handle their operations.

If everyone feels like it's a good idea, Una-G could keep on supplying Smith's forces with food, maybe overprice them a little, but that should be the extent of their interactions. And yeah, let's give Una-G get a connection to our Generators. Don't tell them that we're planning to take care of the gang problem unless we're actually going to be doing that any time soon.

[Stevedore]

Unless there's another stupid rule in the way, we have solid legal grounds to just seize the place. If we do, make sure they know that. If we don't, curse loudly (with the mic off). If we aren't sure, ask High Command.

[The_Codfish]

Stevedore, you need to consider how everyone else would see our actions. We don't want to portray the Saramis as being huge space jerks. Play nice with the other kids and all that, you know?

[BigBurkhart]

I say go with the counter-offer, and let Rainhar chip in if he feels he needs to. We offer repaired and upgraded generators and protection from the gangs in exchange for placing an embargo on Smith's troops. If they're being stubborn, also mention that if they agree, we will not be seeking legal action against their company for aiding a wanted criminal.

Also, I really don't think we should send Hawkeyes to kill Timberhouse. There's just too big of a risk that she'll be spotted, and on top of that, we don't know if he has protection of some kind. I'd like to send Talbat to take care of the quack tomorrow. One day isn't going to mean much for a guy like that, and I just know sending a stealth unit will be better for us on this mission.

[The_Codfish]

Nah, Hawkeyes will probably be safe enough IF Timberhouse isn't secretly being protected. Anyway, the main problem as we know it ISN'T killing Timberhouse; our group is confident in our units' safety and the success of killing Timberhouse. The problem is that Timberhouse is well known and straight out killing him will affect our approval rating negatively. Which is why we wanted Hawkeyes in the first place to deal with this mission. We could always have Hawkeyes prepare the explosives and then let Talbat deliver it instead, though.

[Planet of the Japes]

Ghulls: Nothing concrete, but there's at least ten percent of them who harbor suspicions about our intentions. A few seem to genuinely think we're there to slowly transform them into saramis by putting our ship's fuel into their water supply.

I see what you did there.

Anyway, in my opinion these farm guys are assholes. They're trying to paint themselves as humanitarians, but all they're really doing is making a profit off of other peoples' misfortune. Tell them that we're taking over the farm, and if they try to stop us we'll be happy to send them some food shipments... OF BULLETS.

I suggest we remind these guys that their security system has been barely sufficient to hold off a bunch of untrained gang members, and we have an entire army equipped with combat armor, shields and latest-gen weaponry. Tell them they're going to A) stop dealing with Smith's army and B) stop charging human refugees for supplies, or else.

That being said, DO NOT blow up the whole farm with the Enderfist. It will be a good way to help/control the civilian population. If the Una-G corporate bureaucrats call our bluff (which is likely, considering that they know we want the farm), send in two or three Saramis battalions. That should be more than sufficient to steamroll their defenses.

Once the farm has been taken, any surplus food not needed by our own forces should be distributed free of charge to human refugees. This will help our public image, AND deprive Smith's infantry-oriented army of the food it needs to function. If his forces run short of supplies, they're more likely to surrender, desert, or at least retreat to a different region.

If it seems like I'm being a bit harsh in this situation, chalk it up to the fact that I REALLY hate disaster profiteers.

Stevedore, you need to consider how everyone else would see our actions. We don't want to portray the Saramis as being huge space jerks. Play nice with the other kids and all that, you know?

I doubt the locals see Una G as being exactly saintly themselves. They're using their heavily defended farm to profit in a time that most people have scarce access to food, and shooting anybody who tries to take food for themselves. I think the civilians will be more than happy to see us kick their asses as long as we redistribute more of the food to them (taking the portion that would have gone to Smith's army for our own uses).

I'm opposed to the counter-offer on the grounds that 'these guys are assholes, we don't owe them anything, both our own forces and the local population will be better off if we just cut to the chase and take over the facility"

[Stevedore]

Do we have any intel on how the public perceives Una-G? I doubt it, given we didn't know who they were selling to or even whether they were alive, but if we picked up the Triple-Cores' activities, we probably sifted through a lot of other information too.

[BigBurkhart]

Nah, Hawkeyes will probably be safe enough IF Timberhouse isn't secretly being protected. Anyway, the main problem as we know it ISN'T killing Timberhouse; our group is confident in our units' safety and the success of killing Timberhouse. The problem is that Timberhouse is well known and straight out killing him will affect our approval rating negatively. Which is why we wanted Hawkeyes in the first place to deal with this mission. We could always have Hawkeyes prepare the explosives and then let Talbat deliver it instead, though.

That's a big IF, and I don't like taking unnecessary risks. Plus, it'd be better for our approval rating if he dies in not an explosion. I'd be more willing to have Hawkeyes use her "it was an accident" bombing skills on something like a nightclub that the Rockhearts leaders frequent. This just seems... off.

[The_Codfish]

The fact that it's a big IF should not be a surprise, considering it's capitalized. Heh, and anyway, Talbat is our most competent infiltrator, so it shouldn't be too risky for him to carry and plant one of Hawkeye's explosive concoctions inside Timberhouse's residence.

But yeah, I don't think that there's any reason to not be sure of Hawkeye's specialty. It's in her character description, and we pretty much just got a confirmation from Mayu about her skills in explosives. If she says she can confidently say that she can make it look like an accident, then I'll believe her. The only real problem I see is the execution of the mission, since there are always unknown variables involved. But our spies have likely already gotten as much info as they can from their surveillance, so we just gotta trust them. Besides, it's not even that big of a risk.

Also, I don't think just killing the Rockhearts leader will actually be all that effective. They likely don't rely as much on leadership as they do on brute force. And, like always, we don't want to look like we solve all our problems by blowing up our enemies (outside of the battlefield, since anywhere else, it'd pretty much just be overkill). We should just treat them like we would any other criminal and apprehend them.

[Bloddyredcommie]

Maybe I'm just being paranoid, but I would very much like to inspect the Superfarm. If they're as neutral as they say then no problem, however, if the place has been taken over by Smith troops who are putting some sort of mind-control drug into the food supply, then we have a problem. Before we start treating Una- G as a neutral party, lets make sure that Una-G is calling the shots here.

[DWeird]

Okay! First, I'd like to say that I don't think we can peg UNA-G as war profiteers - if they'd be profiteering, they'd be more in charge of the situation instead of hiding behind their defenses with all their vehicles destroyed. They seem to be in a bad spot, is all - they need to get their goods to their customers (which are likely to be regular people in the cities!), and they turn to the only people they know that can do that. If we were able to guarantee the safety of their supply lines, I'm sure they would rethink their policy on selling to Smith troops. Problem is, that's not something we can do anytime soon - we have enough troops for offensive action but not enough for constant patrols.

But there's a different thing that is even more interesting to me. Now, we were quick to jump to the conclusion that the Smith troops were poisoning the food somehow. But! What if they're not? What if they're only helping food get to hungry people?

That might seem like a strange notion, but - we know for sure that there is at least one Smith army officer who escaped Cyrano with a powerful hate for Smith abominations. If that's the case, if there's a possible reasonable Smith army officer out there, we should definitelly try to talk to him. Perhaps we could negotiate their surrender instead of having to risk both of our troops in bloody battle? Wouldn't hurt to check, and UNA-G probably has a means of constant contact with the Smith troops anyway.


As for Hawkeyes assassinating Timberhouse... With the full knowledge, we'd best not try. We only get the bonus if Timberhouse dies in an 'accident', which won't be the case if anyone sees Hawkeyes there. And she said she sucks at stealth... Maybe if we knew about Timberhouse moving out of his little 'research' center at one point or another, but now, it's best not to risk it.

[Demonsul]

We could always finance certain sections and unscrupulous groups, to keep the military shipments getting through... deals with the raiders, stops Smiths' supplies and we don't have to make ourselves look bad attacking the farm. means we need to be able to trust the raiders, but if we offer them guns they'll probably work for us until they get too big for their boots and we stamp on them - since we're keeping tabs on them that way.

Or, you know, attack Smith troops that are escorting the food for his military, but leave the food shipments themselves for the raiders. Unless he's transporting the food in military vehicles, in which case we blow them up or capture them. Just a suggestion.

[PaperGolem]

show spoiler

hide spoiler

I'm one of the few people I know who didn't like that movie, and that was one of the reasons.

Hm...If she doesn't feel confident herself, then I'm gonna say no on the Hawkeyes vs. Timberhouse mission.

We could always have Hawkeyes prepare the explosives and then let Talbat deliver it instead, though.

Hooray, teamwork! I can dig it.

[Bloddyredcommie]

But there's a different thing that is even more interesting to me. Now, we were quick to jump to the conclusion that the Smith troops were poisoning the food somehow. But! What if they're not? What if they're only helping food get to hungry people?

I'm not saying that is what's happening, I'm saying it's a possibility, and one we should investigate.

At the very least we need to make sure their claims of neutrality are valid, for all we know the farm is now a slave-labor camp being run by smith troops, under constant attack by local rebels trying to free the slaves.

I think the most likely answer is that Una-G is exactly what it appears to be, an agricultural corporation sticking to it's established policy of remaining neutral in times of armed conflict, but we need to be sure.

[JRCrusher]

As for Una-G, nobody seems to have discussed an important point. DWeird kinda touched on it, but didn't develop it. Una-G claims to be selling to civilians. Una-G is also locked in their facility by gang raiders. How does the food get to the cities? Smith's troops transport it.

That is irrelevant. We have legal clearance to sell food or other forms of humanitarian aid to any entity regardless of their crimes. As we have already mentioned, we are neutral towards all parties, as long as they pay for our goods and services. Anyone who can afford to buy is a customer, and every customer deserves security. Also, we feel that we should mention that Smith's forces have been helping us transport food to our other clients, as our vehicles here have been destroyed or stolen by gangs.

If we prevent Smith's troops from accessing the facility then we must IMMEDIATELY provide a way to transport the food to the civilian clients or our rating will take a BIG hit. I don't see us as having that kind of ability. It's not like we can tell Smith's troops "hey, you can come get food but only if you don't use it for yourselves." There is NO REASON they would abide to something like that. If for some suicidal reason we DID try to transport the stuff, then Smith's troops would make sure to attack as many convoys as they could and then frame the lack of food as Saramis cruelty. BAD IDEA.
No matter what we decide, WE CANNOT INTERRUPT THE CIVILIAN SHIPMENTS or there will be a very large outcry, justified or not.

[Chookster]

Let them continue selling, monitor the shipments to smith and carefully screen ours.

Offer them the generator tech in exchange for significant discounts for food, whcih we can then distribute amongst the populace for increased rating, at the same time occasionally sweep a battalion along their border to root out bandits and what have you, lets court them.


Also vote against sending hawkeyes on assassination mission

[Mayu_Zane]

As for Una-G, nobody seems to have discussed an important point. DWeird kinda touched on it, but didn't develop it. Una-G claims to be selling to civilians. Una-G is also locked in their facility by gang raiders. How does the food get to the cities? Smith's troops transport it.

That is irrelevant. We have legal clearance to sell food or other forms of humanitarian aid to any entity regardless of their crimes. As we have already mentioned, we are neutral towards all parties, as long as they pay for our goods and services. Anyone who can afford to buy is a customer, and every customer deserves security. Also, we feel that we should mention that Smith's forces have been helping us transport food to our other clients, as our vehicles here have been destroyed or stolen by gangs.

If we prevent Smith's troops from accessing the facility then we must IMMEDIATELY provide a way to transport the food to the civilian clients or our rating will take a BIG hit. I don't see us as having that kind of ability. It's not like we can tell Smith's troops "hey, you can come get food but only if you don't use it for yourselves." There is NO REASON they would abide to something like that. If for some suicidal reason we DID try to transport the stuff, then Smith's troops would make sure to attack as many convoys as they could and then frame the lack of food as Saramis cruelty. BAD IDEA.
No matter what we decide, WE CANNOT INTERRUPT THE CIVILIAN SHIPMENTS or there will be a very large outcry, justified or not.

You may have just averted disaster by pointing this out. The Una Group has clearly struck a deal with Smith's forces to help distribute food. Whether the enemy is really helping fellow humans who aren't necessarily aligned with them, that remains to be seen.

Next Update: 18 September 2011

[Asmodemus]

Hmm, yes. Well then, don't ask them to stop trading with Smith but ask that they ask Smith's troops to allow Alliance operatives to make sure that it is properly being delivered as well.

Also, if it would not affect us negatively, offer to connect them to our improved generators independently, as a goodwill thing.